Margaal23 ( Kmq2 model map 2013 ).

[Deleted]

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Ahhh finally finished!, ( 27 March 2013 ).

Here is the first model-using map in 15 years Quake2 history for the community.

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Pending review Knightmare ( final check Pk3 file ).
ThX Knightmare for the levelshots, widescreen and Quake2Evolved shaders..


= = = = = Download link = = = = = = = = = =

----> here Margaal23 <----

= = = = = Download link = = = = = = = = = =

HAve fun!..

Screenshotzzz.

[Deleted]

Its looking very nice so far Margaal, for a moment I thought that was a seagull in the first screenshot ;D

It definitely enhances and brings more life into the map with models. One thing I've always wanted to create was a greenery/outdoor type
map and using models seems like the right way to go about it.

Very keen to see the finished result, good work.

[Deleted]

Apr 2, 2013 10:02:59 GMT -5 @margaalq2 said:

ThX for Nice compliments GrOWL..

Perhaps idea to swap seagull against the two beams?.

:P ;D

As I said if I took those beams out the whole place would fall down ;)

I managed to have a tinker around in your map and there's some great things happening in there. The grass & plants really give it that overgrown abandoned feel.
Loved the little touches such as the butterflies, feeding birds and that massive spider! I was looking up close at the wall and next thing a massive spider jumps out at me :)

The gargoyle up the very top seemed a little out of place though, not the model itself but the colours. It looked like it was placed there as opposed to blending in nicely with the rest of the textures. A bit more of a subdued stone look would of looked more natural, really just a personal preference.

The torches however, they looked nice but felt like they needed to look more fiery.
There also seemed to be some sort of lighting glitch below the jacket armor? It could of been my KMQ2 settings though.

In the underground section some of your dirt roofs have a nice uneven surface, but the middle roof in the room its dead flat, it may have tied in better to make that a little less flat.

Also those little blue crystals looks really great, especially with light bloom enabled. Having some bigger versions of these maybe sticking out of the roof underground or out of the walls would of looked very cool and enhanced that bottom area.

Good effort with the map, its good to see someone take advantage of what KMQ2 has to offer.

[Deleted]

Thanks for commentZ.

I repair, Fix underground section. ( thX GrOWL )..

===== new download is available ===


= =

I was hoping that M23 model map bring some more life on this Q2forum.
But.....Unfortunate so quiet, .....pity pity.


Good weather ( Summer ) is coming, enjoy.
after work, at home, sit in the Sun relaxing.

= =

[m]

HEY!

It's a beautiful map, for a great game, that I wish I had time for.

I'm sorry for my loooooong absence, but life is crammed and jammed. There are so many things pulling me in so many directions, I don't have the time I used to for Q2 :-(

You're making spectacular maps though! I do get a chance to play around in them.

[Deleted]

Hey!..

ThX for the nice words Maric...

I appreciate

[Null]

Nice looking map Margaal!
Awesome attention to detail.
Although the code might be a little different, our mod also supports models and lazarus type trains via r1q2 override files, and also during live online games. I got your models loading just fine. Ex:

{
"usermodel" "mapobjects/animals/gargole/gargoyle1.md2"
"classname" "model_spawn"
"origin" "332 -221 60"
}

Above the gargoyle, there's a Millennium Falcon flying around a spline on a marics map ;D


There's a problem with blocklights size though. I'm aware that at the moment margaal23 will only run on Quake2Evolved / KMQ2, because when I try to run it on regular quake 2 I get "Bad s_blocklights size". I tried to re-light it with the following to reduce chopsize but that didn't help:
ARGHRAD -threads 2 -chop 128 -chopcurve 128 -choplight 32 -chopsky 1024 -chopwarp 128 margaal23.bsp

I traced the error to this place:

void R_BuildLightMap (msurface_t *surf, byte *dest, int stride)
{

....

smax = (surf->extents[0]>>4)+1;
tmax = (surf->extents[1]>>4)+1;
size = smax*tmax;
if (size > (sizeof(s_blocklights)>>4) )
ri.Sys_Error (ERR_DROP, "Bad s_blocklights size"); <------
...

#define BLOCKLIGHT_SIZE 3
static float s_blocklights[34*34*BLOCKLIGHT_SIZE];

I could dig deeper, but you probably know a quicker way to fix this.

You got to know, a lot of people still play quake 2 online and wouldn't mind enjoying this map in a deathmatch environment. Here are usage statistics for top 10 Quake 2 clients used on Tastyspleen servers based on the number of connections from a few months back:

10861 3.20 x86 Oct 16 1998 Win32 RELEASE
8397 R1Q2 b8012 x86 Sep 13 2011 Win32 RELEASE
5391 R1Q2 b7904 x86 Oct 25 2008 Win32 RELEASE
617 AprQ2 v1.211 x86 Nov 7 2007 Win32 RELEASE
478 3.21 NON-WIN32 Jun 6 2006 NON-WIN32
313 q2pro r1093 May 30 2011 Win32 x86
261 3.23 x86 Feb 23 2010 Win32 RELEASE
221 NoCheat 2.40 x86 May 4 2004 Win32 RELEASE
197 3.19 x86 Sep 1 1998 Win32 RELEASE
168 EGL v0.3.1-R1: Sep 14 2007 Win32-x86

www.tastyspleen.net/quake/servers/list.cgi

If you add up R1Q2, it's still the most used and reliable client, and it'd be nice if it was supported as well, at least with alternative map version. In R1GL mode it also handles md3 models and high-res jpg & png textures. On Whale server (74.86.171.203:27910) which is kept busy around the clock, most people use R1Q2.. and we're always looking for new maps like this. So, would it be possible to recompile the bsp to run on r1q2.exe with reduced blocklights size? That way this map would see quite a bit more exposure. To be honest I'm pretty sure if the target client isn't on that list, it's mostly just used for single player. As nice as it is, all this hard work might not see much light of day. An alternative version could easily change that ;D

Null

[knightmare]

Re-lighting the map won't work, because the difference is due to how the brush surfaces are split up (-chop 1024). Recompiling the map with this value changed would result in much higher r_speeds.

It would be much, much easier to just recompile R1GL with a larger s_blocklights array:

static float s_blocklights[136*136*BLOCKLIGHT_SIZE]; // Knightmare-  was [34*34*3], supports max chop size of 1024

R1ch just needs to add this change, just like the the fixes for moving and animated trans surfaces and dlights on bmodels he's neglected for years.

[Deleted]

Thanks NuLL..

But, a euh?.....Soryy, `m just a mapper, know nothing about technical stuff ( Kmq2 or R1Q2 )...
I Use kmqbsp3 compile tool for Kmq2..


static float s_blocklights[136*136*BLOCKLIGHT_SIZE]; // Knightmare-  was [34*34*3], supports max chop size of 1024


ThX Knightmare for help...

Regards

[Null]

Jul 12, 2013 7:05:19 GMT -5 @margaalq2 said:

Thanks NuLL..

But, a euh?.....Soryy, `m just a mapper, know nothing about technical stuff ( Kmq2 or R1Q2 )...
I Use kmqbsp3 compile tool for Kmq2..

It's nothing technical really. I suppose prior to Margaal23, you've always used the qbsp3.exe qvis3.exe and arghrad.exe combination to compile your maps, for say margaal22 and below. So this wouldn't be anything different. If you want the majority of the people online (~99%) to still be able to play your maps, it'd be best to just compile alternative Margaal23b version with these tools again. Not saying you shouldn't release versions for newer clients. I got to say Knightmare is doing a awesome job with his modern client. Nevertheless, I don't know anyone who uses Kmq2 in multiplayer to be honest, and TS server network has the most Quake 2 players online. You can look up the statistics. It's rather impossible to force the online player base to change clients, and enforce new standards this late in the game. They're used to their: lag less, fast loading and efficient configurations that they have fined tuned over the years. Thus, it's best to just keep some sort of support for the most popular protocol out there, unless of course you want this to be a single player experience, with a tiny audience. It'd be a shame because online you can get exponentially more exposure for your map. To make this a WIN - WIN for everyone, is as simple as compiling a secondary version with the tools you've been using prior to this map.

[Deleted]

Hey Null.

Yeah Knightmare did a awesome job!, ( update patch for Kmq2 ).
i really do not understand why people still use Q2, it has many limits ( Old Engine bla bla bla ), Kmq2 in multiplayer has so many more to offer!,pity pity to miss all this beauty...

But oke....

Yesterday compile Margaal23 with normal toolz for Q2
(Unfortunately you see no models).

i delete all model_spawn and add alternative light for the model torches ).

= = = = = Download link = = = = = = = = = =

secondary version Margaal23b for Q2.

----> here Margaal23b <----

= = = = = Download link = = = = = = = = = =

[NIN-Kitsune]

Nothing wrong at all with attempting to take mapping to the future beyond R1Q2, we in currently unannounced ways are doing something alike as well. We just like to provide support both to new and old at the same time long as there is a decent playerbase which we still have. Null has amazing tools that makes it easy to convert stuff over to R1Q2 I wouldn't have imagined possible unless I saw myself.

It is true we have very good model support for placing in environments going on for R1Q2 and other features coming along as well that is starting to bridge the gap between the old Quake II we know and still love, to the more modern things expected. So it's not like your maps have to miss out on much with R1Q2, just do as you feel is best and comfortable with and we can worry about the technical details. Keep up the good work Margaal, it's always much appreciated by the players!

[Null]

Margaal,
We all really appreciate your hard work! We couldn't let all the cool model additions go unnoticed so we re-added them via overrides! You got to know that a lot of people on the servers depend on your kick ass maps, so please don't get discouraged with us or Quake 2. We're looking into the future as well and are in the process of considering modern client options! I guess it's not impossible to make the switch if proper advertising and attention is exerted in the right areas. In fact I've developed many modern tools for converting Quake data. I've also recently investigated the Q3 scene, but I found it too alienating so I decided to stick with Q2. If KMQ2 would support native mods, we could easily adapt it as our multiplayer client. Here's what the same map looks like on regular Q2 in weapons mod with all your models still intact and animating. (Don't mind my ultra bright settings, and a few Vis issues with transparency that I still need to resolve. I think it looks pretty good nevertheless, considering I wasn't even using R1GL or high-res textures ;D )























(P.S. I was having so much fun in the map I modified vulture's skin just a little bit )

[NIN-Kitsune]

Well, there we go =^.^=, if it weren't for the gamma I could be fooled into thinking it's the same client! Came out beautifully! That's pretty much what I've been experimenting with lately for touching up environmental details!

[Deleted]

ThX Null & NIN-KitsuneSnout ....

Map looks good how it should!......Yeah have a good feeling..
good work!.

Models brings more life into the map, a little extra!.
it`s also good for my inspiration and map motivation, ( finish the map in short time ).

sooo.... ;D
at the moment i enjoy the good weather, my pond, etc etc
so i keep a small map break....am back soon with new model maps with secondary b versions.