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Post by cocerello on Apr 2, 2015 4:48:29 GMT -5
There is good necroposting and bad necroposting. Good one is when you provide some useful info to the thread, bad is when what you type is useless, usually of the type, i like it too. This one is defintely of the good type.
The problem, some people hear that necroposting is bad and think that it relates to all the necroposting.
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Post by cocerello on Apr 2, 2015 4:45:32 GMT -5
It was too good to be true, it was to good to be true, it was too good to be true ... T_T
The better the news are, the harder is to reject them, even if one knows deep down that something is suspicious, even given the amount of hints Null gave.
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Post by cocerello on Apr 1, 2015 3:34:28 GMT -5
What a surprise! Didn't expect the contest to have actual prizes. If have known that i would be thinking on what would be good for bribing ... Any ideas?
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Post by cocerello on Apr 1, 2015 2:39:46 GMT -5
That was his strategy, Null. Surprise the judges. He probably had the new version on store and pre-released the older one as bait. Congrats Macanah, for being the last counting from down! Thanks to everyone at this community for hosting and organizing this contest, and everyone participating for providing a challenge. For those that missed it, look well at what you missed, and participate on the next so you won't miss this again. Still checking the scores, but found something that i don't get. Why do i have a rating so high in sounds in 2cocedm02? I haven't placed a single target_speaker in that map, as i ran out of time, so i should be getting 0 points, not 41. What else is rated in that category? Now i'll really be needing a lot that feedback , i wouldn't ever have rated myself so high, i need to understand what i did so well to get so high positions. I expected myself to be on the lower half or even on the last ones with 2cocedm01. I hope you didn't play my maps with the default brightness settings in the original engine like i told you, missed that i used gl_modulate 2.5 when tested them. With gl_modulate 1 the first one looks quite bad, apart from dark.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 30, 2015 11:41:56 GMT -5
Good point there, Jaydolan. Given the restrictions Quake 2 textures place on the brushes, relying on textures without major features is a good way to go to avoid these problems. It also helps a lot the mapper to free him from on axis faces and so he can try with more freedom different architectural forms. For example, i had to use this kind of textures extensively in my first map submitted for the contest, as i had no other way to texture the brushes i used on two thirds of the map.
But when using this kind of textures, one should be careful with tiling, even more when taking into account that Quake 2's textures without major features on them are usually very bad at tiling, and most of the rest of them too, unfortunately. Also, the mapper has to take into account that using this textures means that the faces will be visually less busy, so they'll probably need more work on lighting (usually more contrast (hard taking into consideration radiosity) and brushwork to make up for it, point that tends to be important as quake 2 textures are quite visually busy.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 29, 2015 14:29:26 GMT -5
Three sub-forums sounds good. But maybe would be even better putting the rules and dates apart in the root of the Contest subforum to make them stand out more and make the third the general one, with things related to non-mapping, or using the root of the subforum for that too, and putting the rules and deadlines as stickys.
Similar to those suggestions, i think that organizing the threads and adding more sticky threads dedicated to important info or a very used tool or engine would be good to attract new blood.
For example, it would be better if there were a list of editors/tools/compilers/tutorials/... in the forum before this contest happened and Le Ray posted one about editors, or at least a thread dedicated to each editor for news/troubleshooting. As it is now, everyone when has something new or just want to ask any small thing open his own thread with its naming convention, which isn't bad by itself, but makes things harder to find and harder to know all there is out there. I personally barely relied on this forum except on a few threads made for this contest when searching for editors, engines, tools, compilers, tutorials, textures, ... as there was barely any centralized info on it and would have to dig for it bit a bit. This can hinder new mappers a lot, having to search for each thing separately.
A balance of the two types of threads would be better: for the most important things have them have their own unique (or two (news and questions)) thread (sticky or not) and for the rest open new ones.
Also, i noticed that there is threads out of its subforums, which makes harder to search for things. Mapping central subforum for example doesn't look like that sometimes.
But first of all, the first thing to do to help this community and probably the most useful would be to advertise it more than what has been done already, if needed on out of the usual places, like those swarmed with people like Youtube, Facebook, Twitter, ... and the like. Maybe with that last option we won't get much more mappers but instead players, but could be good enough even with that.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 27, 2015 9:33:23 GMT -5
Thanks for the guide.
Looks good, as a duels basic explanation and also because its always good to get reminded the basics, no matter how much experience one can have.
Have barely played duels, and never made one, but these explanations works for all the ultiplayer game modes to some extent.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 27, 2015 9:04:59 GMT -5
Could be a good idea, getting feedback from the judges, as a reward for the mappers and so their mood improve for mapping. Just 3 or 4 lines per judge just like you did now. That can be good for the mapper also to improve, no matter if the comment are possitive or negative, and no matter if he/she is going to work on the contest's maps or not, as any advice, can work for future maps.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 21, 2015 15:43:57 GMT -5
Yeah, Jaydolan, you were right from the start, i failed big. Tried what you said and worked, what i don't understand is why it says on ClanWos' webpage that its only for dynamic lighting when from what you have shown, affects static too. Interesting.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 21, 2015 7:53:27 GMT -5
Yes, it isn't a big deal., but i prefer for things to be clear, and learn more. About what you are saying: I don't know about the code or about all the new engines out there, as i have tried only a few. So. explain this to me, then. Try again with original engine in 3.20 patch in q2dm1 for example, preferably on a dark room (machinegun one or rocketlauncher ones work the best) and put gl_modulate 1 (default), gl_modulate 0 and gl_modulate 6 (values higher than 6 don't give any noticeable change). The only thing that changes in those maps are the items and player's hand and weapon, period. Tested it on a clean install of the game, so no external factors can be accounted. Also this: www.clanwos.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=97:3-console-commands-list&catid=48:quake-2-console-commands&Itemid=94gl_modulate
Type: Register
Default: 1
Description: The brightness of a texture while it is being affected by dynamic lights.
Note: If the value is less than 1 then the texture which on which the dynamic light is displayed will be darker than it's normal color. If the value is more than 1 then the texture will be brighter. This variable is mostly used to brighten up the lighting in the game without changing any gamma information.
Which explains the behavior on original quake 2 engine quite well.
If you say you have checked many engines and haven't found this behavior, my guess for now is that most new engines use a different gl_modulate from the original engine's one and you got so accustomed to it that forgot how the original worked (quite common on the Quake and Quake 3 communities), so as you say, the issue isn't as bad.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 21, 2015 5:18:21 GMT -5
As by map rules maps for the contest should work on the original engine, i tested it on default brightness settings on the original engine with 3.20 patch on, so most of you'll probably see my map bright and washed up, from what i have read this last months in this forum about what settings people use.
EDIT: i did not notice this till now, but my maps were tested in the original engine with the original engine's brightness settings except that i raised gl_modulate to 2.5. With the default gl_modulate (1) the maps are too dark and some parts look very bad.
But the issue is that posting this won't help us much, seeing that most people tested it on their own choice of engines. First for all the issues Spirit pointed out. second, what Null pointed out in Giftmacher's thread about each engine having its own way of dealing with brightness. Third, i noticed something related to the second issue: apart from each engine having its own way of doing things, Q2Pro's gl_modulate does a very different thing to what it does in the original engine. In the original engine it only affects dynamic lighting, so in the original deathmatch maps that means that only or almost only items will be affected, having a small importance, almost aesthetic and up to what each person likes , but in Q2Pro it affects static lighting instead of dynamic, hence affecting almost everything on each map and being a major command. And if it happens in this case, there is probably many other cases in Q2Pro and other engines, adding to the problem.
So, to summarize, it will be even worse than what Spirit pointed out, not only each map has to be played in a specific configuration, but has to be played on a particular engine for it to look as intended.
For the next contest maybe would be better to put an exact engine and settings as a rule, as long as you want for maps to look as intended, which isn't necessary, and its a pain in the ass, as pointed out above.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 20, 2015 16:54:56 GMT -5
The map is done and prepared to submit. Still have some issues like the buttons not working the first time, but are minor.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 20, 2015 4:16:51 GMT -5
Yeah, you definitely need something on those walls if you remove the flags, even now with them on those walls still look a bit flat. You could take out some of the stone blocks, or make some simulated windows (they don't go anywhere but as they are high no one will notice it. Probably the best option is put some brush that goes out from the wall, so you have the brush and the shadow that it cast to add detail for the wall.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 18, 2015 5:49:27 GMT -5
First of all, its your decision, but, given what you are saying about the variety of engines and settings, then the more reason to use the only default we all have, Quake 2's original engine defaults (or similar ones from other engines), even more considering one of the rules of this contest is that the map works on it, so all the mappers have tested their maps on it, so the intended for the mapper look is that one, so it looks like a better option than choosing a subjective point of way like what looks best. If someone uses another engine or settings and it looks bad, its his problem, if it looks bad on the original engine and settings, is the mapper's problem.
So, in my opinion, is that when you show the contest's maps, the intended way the mapper thought off (or similar looking settings) should be used, to put all of them in equal footing and respect the mapper's choice. Truth to be told, this can be seen as something trivial, but i have seen problems arise due to things similar in other mapping communities. Small non mapper intended changes in looks can break maps. Not in this case, as this is an small issue, so this is just an example.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 17, 2015 17:13:16 GMT -5
Don't worry and thanks, i know its dangerous to depend on brush entities for that, and the virtues of detail brushes. What i didn't knew were the details you are providing. Very interesting indeed. also don't know how to use SURF_HINT, CONTENTS_DETAIL, SURF_SKIP, but i'll learn that on the next map.
About the map itself its going very well. It is almost complete, just have to so some tweaks here and there. r_speeds are good on it, with 700 wploys at the highest.
The bad part, i have two bugs i don't know how to fix. - I have items on top of func_plats. They spawn well, but after i take them, when respawning, they do below the plat, instead of on top of it. Is it fixable or is a common Quake 2's behavior? - I have a button that never triggers the first time is pressed. the rest of the times works fine, only the first fails. Very strange.
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