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Post by cocerello on Mar 16, 2015 14:33:33 GMT -5
Was gl_modulate the only thing you changed between the two? I'm surprised that there is so many dynamic lighting in there that the difference is so big. by the way, i'm liking way more the later screenshots, except the last one from the penultimate pack of screenshots.
On this matter, the screenshots of the previous contests were brighter than default, so i suppose is a common behavior.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 16, 2015 8:44:32 GMT -5
Yeah, its that or turning them into func_walls, Jitspoe. Vis time isn't a concern with this map, with 10-15 seconds on fastvis and 2-3 minutes on a full vis. Accostumed to fullvising that takes hours and hours this is a bliss, as i can even check lighting and details, or even just how much the visdata has changed if i change something in the map, tons of times without concern. I'm checking r_speeds from time to time, but as i did the layout with them in mind, i haven't gotten anything big (500-1000wpoly on most areas and some with 2000-2500 (the ones with the detail i showed before) on fastvis, and half of that or even less with a fullvis). This map is being a fight against Quake 2's vis compiler and original engine. Everytime i hit a limit, i check what i can change to lower it. The first time deleted some rooms and deleted the details mentioned above, the second turned lots of things into detail brushes, and now i am close to hit the limit a third time, the limit on fastvising, with a ''Vismap expansion overflow'' warning, and between those times i twist the layout to reduce visibility as much as possible. Well, the main reason this happens isn't that the map has many open areas, which hasn't, but more that it is a monster in size (typical beginner map error ). What isn't so typical is that it isn't related to beign overambitious as usual in this caes, but more to a bad early decision on brushwork style. Progress in the map has been getting slower, as i also got lots of leaf portal saw into leaf errors. Even though i know they aren't critical by reading Aguirre's and Qworkshop's advices, i get remembered of those times back in 199x when i continued mapping in WC1.1.2 for Quake without caring about compiling errors, because didn't know a thing about them neither had Internet or someone to ask to, so now with all the info there is out there the perfectionist in me won over mysel and fixed them all. Overall, its being an interesting lesson on mapping.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 15, 2015 6:57:27 GMT -5
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Post by cocerello on Mar 14, 2015 12:25:44 GMT -5
I remember getting the ''WARNING: msg overflowed for'' message in the map i am working on. It stopped appearing when i deleted several entities till their number dropped below around 30, which had with the same classname and had the flag to start on. Or maybe this: sz_GetSpace: overflow
WARNING: msg overflowed for Envious
Netchan_Transmit: dumped unreliable
Envious is my multiplayer character name. The errors appear to continuously scroll in the console. They appear when I enter a door from one particular side. I have a func_areaportal in this door, and I was going to remove the areaportal just to see if this had anything to do with it (haven't done it yet). I also had the errors appear at another door (also with an areaportal). I had to resize some brushes in that area for alignment purposes, and now that door doesn't give the errors anymore. When the errors occur, the screen goes to a cross between a hall of mirros effect and an earthquake of sorts. That's the best way I can see to describe it. You can't move while it's happening, either, only look around. Then I get the Netchan_Transmit error and the view jumps to an area nearby where the error happened.Got it from here: www.quake2.com/qworkshop/info/errors/startup.htm
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Post by cocerello on Mar 14, 2015 6:31:59 GMT -5
Interesting discussion here
About the matter about r_speeds. Do for the judging of the map count epolys+wpolys, only wpolys, or the higher of the two? I suppose its wpolys only, but i want to be sure.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 12, 2015 7:09:13 GMT -5
Yes, you are right, Null, an all-out war is more tiring, guerrilla tactics divide the war in several more manageable objectives One third done completely. I used several setpieces to improve the mapping speed, but the setpieces themselves were way harder to make than expected, and gave many problems, so one thing nullified the other, and there was no improvement in speed. At least that part is done and the rest will be easier. The last surprise i got was this: I overstimated Quake 2 original engine capabilities, and got this error when opening the map: ERROR: map has too large visibility lumpIn fact i surpassed the limit by doubling it, and the culprit was this (and 17 more like it). Which achieved by themselves more than 1x10^6 (the limit is around 0.9x10^6) visdata. It was a surprise, as i tried to keep visibility as low as possible (and it is (10 sec to vis)). So i had to delete them and part of the map, which is a shame, but at the rate i was, the rest of what i have planned wouldn't fit on the engine's limits even by deleting those 18 setpieces. Also, while investigating this i found something surprising. Aren't world brushes supposed to block vis? Because i get high r_speeds when i face (and touch) a flat wall if it faces to where the rest of the map is, and even more i i look at the center of the map from a side of it. And more importantly, there is no leaks in the map. And finally, a question for you all: Is it unusual nowadays to play a map for 6 players max? It is going to be hard to add more spawns than 6 in this one.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 12, 2015 4:29:00 GMT -5
Greetings! Here i am opening this to update my status an let you know i am on the breach. Currently i am mapping slowly but steadily, after searching all over for everything needed for mapping and chosing an editor (Jackhammer). This has been more interesting than i thought, relearning mapping for Quake 2 which i haven't touched in who knows how many years, and making a DM map, which i am not used to, as even as a player i barely play DM, as i myself and my friends always prefered to play CTF or assault the base modes in any shooting videogame. Unfortunately, i won't have time to learn all the options Quake 2 give, so my map would fit any videogame, textures aside, which will have to be Quake 2 Id ones (Jackhammer's issue), and i can't assure that the gameplay will fit DM one, much less the one Quake 2 players are accustomed to, but i can assure you one thing, it will be a strange map, as that's what i usually tend to map . Screenshots and more will come soon!
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Post by cocerello on Mar 12, 2015 4:17:02 GMT -5
Looks good and almost done, for 6-8 players. On the advice side, I would be careful with blockiness in brushwork and vis, based on those shots, and add some more detail where it won't interfere with r_speeds greatly.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 6, 2015 12:56:41 GMT -5
BTW cocerello, when will we see your WIP thread? I'm really curious what you got going Been trying to get some editors working to choose one and finally map. Chose Jackhammer, even though has some problems here and there, as expected of an editor that haven't been out for long. Mapping now, slowly but solidly. About the thread and the map itself, i think in a smilar way to Pan, i prefer to don't show too much of the map so the player don't lose that first experience that he won't get ever again, and so i don't have to deal with player's and judge's expectations, so i don't think i'll show a lot. I'll say more when i open the thread.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 6, 2015 12:44:27 GMT -5
I agree too, but i'm more concerned that with public feedback this contest is turning more into a community map pack, which isn't bad either. Thought that from the beginning, but thought also that it was a custom in the previous contests, as no one said a thing.
The good points of showing early the works: raises the hype of non-mappers and keeps them interested on it.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 1, 2015 15:33:30 GMT -5
Both versions look good, but now that you have deleted the contrast red-brown with green, you have to add something or change some textures so it doesn't look too homogeneous, maybe adding some orange or dark yellow trims or going with Spirit's idea. Also, the lighting is obvious were it comes from in the areas with the bigger faces specially standing out that fact, so try to hide them a bit adding more or reducing the wait key in the light's properties, or by going with Spirit's idea.
For now, the room that looks the best in those shots is the one from the first screenshot in the first post, due to having several levels to run and more places that catch the attention, but i would reduce the brightness or the saturation coming from the slime's lighting, but now that you have changed it for lava, it doesn't matter.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 1, 2015 14:56:35 GMT -5
Really nice brush work, and level layout. But like cocerello mentioned, it could use some custom textures to really make it stand out That part of my comment was more about adding or substituting in the map with just one or two textures with a different color or one texture that would stand out by itself and wasn't a light, changing to another set is more like a personal preference and up to the mapper than other areas of mapping, so i tend to don't say a thing about that. But i think that with iD Quake2 textures the map can look good enough In my case i tend to go with more common textures, to focus on the rest of the map, but custom textures (which in Quake 2 tend to be in higher resolution (from Quake 3 usually)) can be good to hide mistakes, specially in squarish faces if the textures are quite sharp, even though i don't usually like them, like for example hh3_clockwork texture set by Rorschach, that is too sharp in my opinion for Quake and Quake 2 (in Quake 3 it could fit better). I think that the higher in detail the textures are, the higher in detail the brushwork should be so they fit better together.
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Post by cocerello on Mar 1, 2015 14:40:08 GMT -5
Strange, for me both the one i posted (if i copy the url) and the one you posted work. looks like it doesn't accept the ' in the link.
Spirit, if you copy the url i provide is it broken for you? No matter what happens i'll put the url without the ' for avoiding problems, but i want to know if it works for you too.
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Post by cocerello on Feb 28, 2015 18:32:22 GMT -5
Looks good and promising: varied rooms in size, theme, and combat options, with personality and cohesive. Corridors are more than just the typical square corridor. To improve, maybe you should add another color to the texture set, and add contrast in lighting, specially in third, fourth and sixth screenshots, is hard to distinguish some brushes from each other.
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Post by cocerello on Feb 27, 2015 7:01:50 GMT -5
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